Can't seem to get a 'reply' facility at present, so I'll start a new topic, but it is meant as a reply to Ged & Co.

We disagree on our presupositions.  Your starting point is that human reason must be final on the assumption that man is not a fallen creature whose thinking is prejudiced by sin.  There is no rational basis for this and your basic presupposition contains an inherent cotradiction.  The assumption that human reason is reliable is unreasonable.  That men make this irrational assumption is easily accounted for if one believes the Bible and the account of man's fall and the fact that the essence of sin is the desire to be 'as gods' (Gen.3:5).  For a Christian, the whole atheistic approach to science entails a pretence - that man is independent of God for his existence and the knowledge and purpose of it.

The Christian presupposition has three main strands: 1. The God revealed in the Bible is.  2.  The Bible is his word.  3. Fallen man is absolutely dependent upon a Sovereign work of the Holy Spirit of God in his heart (which the Bible calls being 'born again'), in order to be willing and able to rightly receive the message of the Bible as the word of God.  The place of reason is as the God-given means through which, when a man's sinful nature is renewed by the Holy Spirit, he not only understands and admits the truth of God's word but gladly embraces it as such.  Human reason is receptive, not legislative.

Yes, the Christian's presupposition is a closed circle, but it is not contrary to reason whereas the atheistic rationalist's is.